Gizmos Freeware Reviews  

Go Back   Gizmo's Freeware Forum > Debating Chamber > Internet, Web Apps and Networking

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 24. Nov 2014, 11:51 PM   #11 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
deya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1,518
Default

Thanks for that. I wish they'd just post this stuff on their blog page. No point having it otherwise.
deya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25. Nov 2014, 01:11 PM   #12 (permalink)
Super Moderator
 
Anupam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: India
Posts: 15,329
Default

I find the Opera site quite weird. The changelog is buried deep within links, and you have to figure it out for yourself how to reach it. Don't know why they cannot provide a simple link to the changelog besides the download button, or somewhere visible on the download page, like on Firefox site.

Also, often, like in this case, the changelog is not updated soon.

This does not reflect nicely on Opera.
__________________
Anupam
Anupam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25. Nov 2014, 09:24 PM   #13 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
deya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1,518
Default

They seem to be changing the layout of the Desktop blog just lately. What the point of that might be when they don't bother to post about the latest stable version I'm really not sure.

But anyway, Opera does still improve. I like the new homepage, which has an even better layout in the latest Developer 27.0.

They just need to brush up their communication skills
deya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26. Nov 2014, 01:41 AM   #14 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
danielson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,156
Default

Opera used to be fun.
Not just the browser but even their forum.
Even Chuck Norris used to post there!
I'm so wary or bored of all these Chrome clones.
They remind me of all the Linux distros; they all have something nice and unique to offer, but you just wished they could put it all together in one package.
danielson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26. Nov 2014, 08:55 AM   #15 (permalink)
Super Moderator
 
Anupam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: India
Posts: 15,329
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by danielson View Post
I'm so wary or bored of all these Chrome clones.
Same here. They all look the same to me, and also behave the same. That's just plain boring. If I want to use a different browser, I want it look different, feel different, have some difference, so that I can enjoy it, and not feel like I am using the same browser, with a different name.

Opera however, have managed to give a different feel to the browser, but still, it essentially is just another Chrome clone.
__________________
Anupam
Anupam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26. Nov 2014, 09:57 PM   #16 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
deya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1,518
Default

I think Opera have at least tried to make their browser more than just another Chrome clone, although yes, essentially that's what it is. I like the new start page and the bookmarks are good enough for me now. I use Discover a lot more than I ever thought I would, you can edit it to display the kind of news you want, and by country. It's a good feature. Once you've enabled the power user settings you can also get rid of the awful Google search bar from the start page, which makes it look much better - in my opinion, although I don't believe you should have to go searching for power user settings to do that. A money thing I suppose, which, on reflection, is fair enough. But at least the option is now there to do it.

The choice of extensions is good, although I still don't use many. Five is still all I have installed and don't really feel the need to install more. You can't customise the UI like you could with the old Opera but, oddly enough, I don't miss that at all.

Opera Turbo is still a very useful tool to have, especially if you live here, where ISP's block every torrent site etc there is - mine seem to be the worst for it, but with Turbo enabled you can bypass all that nonsense and search through TPB and all the rest 'til your heart's content. No extension required.

I'm using Developer 27.0 at the moment, in this version you can now set DDG as your default search engine, including others. DDG has replaced Bing. So that's another good improvement, and doubtless there will be more on the way.

It may not be the old Opera. It is, technically, a Chrome clone but to lump it in with all the others is a little wide of the mark in all fairness. They've had an awful lot of criticism, much of it deserved, but they've turned a corner with the development of the browser now.

They may not always communicate very well but they do seem to listen to what their users want and have implemented changes accordingly in many cases, and although it's impossible to please everyone they do appear to try and appease the many users who demand the old Opera features. A thankless task, but I do respect them for trying, and that's why I continue to use the browser. It is capable of doing more than other Chrome clones, you just have to have a little look around.
deya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27. Nov 2014, 03:58 PM   #17 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
danielson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,156
Default

@deya,

The thing is, its not just about Opera.
There have been a slew of let downs over the last couple of years:
1. Firefox Australis.
2. Google dropping their RSS Reader and Notes.
3. Feedly going "shareware" route.

Just a slew of things that have made the "geeks" rightly upset.
Most people don't know what a browser is yet and the "geeks" are the ones that make the difference. If you don't show them any respect, you loose some key people.

It's just a reflection of the general attitude of big companies who don't really care about the well-being of their employees.
danielson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27. Nov 2014, 07:15 PM   #18 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
deya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1,518
Default

Good points, and I would agree that upsetting and losing the support of the geeks, power users or whatever, will have a negative impact on the development of a product. After all, it's those users who take the time to put these programs through their paces - Alpha, Beta etc, send crash reports and feedback which ultimately helps the developers iron out all the bugs and rough spots to make the end product a better one.

But in the end it's all about keeping pace with the times, and times change. Most people don't want complicated, they want simple. Click, open, browse, click, close. That's it. Quick browse, quick news, quick social media, quick share - all of that. Opera couldn't continue with Presto, they had to change and so they opted for the most popular route which at this time is Chromium/Blink. Browser's simplified for the masses. Likewise with Firefox and the new design. Simplified.

Take for an example a browser like Lunascape, a very good browser but one which would overwhelm most people to set up because they would consider it too complicated. It would faze them, they'd lose interest because it's really one for the more geeky type. The consequence of that? - you never hardly see it mentioned.

Then there are the economics of it all. Search engine partnerships - Google. Because give away products, like browsers, have to be funded somehow. The obligatory search bar on virtually every start page. As I mentioned, in Opera's case you can enable power user settings and disable it from the start page - if you know how. But they don't want most people to know how, they want them using it for the revenue and, if we're honest, that's what most people want to use anyway.

Yes, many of the Opera geeks feel they have been shown no respect, Otter Browser is proof of that and I for one hope that it succeeds. Question is, what will 'most people' want to use?

Niche browsers will always have their place, and that's great. But without the volunteer input of the geeks they nearly always end up fizzling out with a gradual slow down of development because the responsibility of keeping it going, the time involved, becomes too much of a burden. Big companies don't run like that. It would be financial suicide. They have to move with the times and I think we, as users, have to try and appreciate that because at the end of it all we're still getting free products.


...... even though they all look the same
deya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27. Nov 2014, 08:11 PM   #19 (permalink)
Super Moderator
 
Anupam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: India
Posts: 15,329
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by deya View Post
I think Opera have at least tried to make their browser more than just another Chrome clone, although yes, essentially that's what it is. I like the new start page and the bookmarks are good enough for me now. I use Discover a lot more than I ever thought I would, you can edit it to display the kind of news you want, and by country. It's a good feature. Once you've enabled the power user settings you can also get rid of the awful Google search bar from the start page, which makes it look much better - in my opinion, although I don't believe you should have to go searching for power user settings to do that. A money thing I suppose, which, on reflection, is fair enough. But at least the option is now there to do it.

The choice of extensions is good, although I still don't use many. Five is still all I have installed and don't really feel the need to install more. You can't customise the UI like you could with the old Opera but, oddly enough, I don't miss that at all.

Opera Turbo is still a very useful tool to have, especially if you live here, where ISP's block every torrent site etc there is - mine seem to be the worst for it, but with Turbo enabled you can bypass all that nonsense and search through TPB and all the rest 'til your heart's content. No extension required.

I'm using Developer 27.0 at the moment, in this version you can now set DDG as your default search engine, including others. DDG has replaced Bing. So that's another good improvement, and doubtless there will be more on the way.

It may not be the old Opera. It is, technically, a Chrome clone but to lump it in with all the others is a little wide of the mark in all fairness. They've had an awful lot of criticism, much of it deserved, but they've turned a corner with the development of the browser now.

They may not always communicate very well but they do seem to listen to what their users want and have implemented changes accordingly in many cases, and although it's impossible to please everyone they do appear to try and appease the many users who demand the old Opera features. A thankless task, but I do respect them for trying, and that's why I continue to use the browser. It is capable of doing more than other Chrome clones, you just have to have a little look around.
Thanks for posting a detailed reply, deya. I know you have used and liked Opera for a long time. It's always good to read from you, and this was a good post.

I haven't used Opera much, but I do have it installed out of curiosity... intend to look around more when I get time. I do agree that although based on Chrome, they have indeed managed to keep the feel of the browser different, and have made a conscious effort for it.. since the beginning. That's something good.

Still, I am really bored of all these Chrome designs all over the browsers ..
__________________
Anupam
Anupam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28. Nov 2014, 03:23 PM   #20 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
danielson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,156
Default

Very nice write up indeed!
The folks at Opera should hire you!

Fact is also that some Chrome extensions are not yet available or don't work with Opera that i can also enjoy with Firefox (Similarweb for example). Sure, it's only one example but i could find others. Firefox and Chrome have most extensions that we need.

Sure, it might not take long before Opera catches up to being a perfect clone of Google Chrome (ha!) but then again, if it took them only over a year to finally get a decent bookmark manager, who knows! By then, Google will have come up with something new (like dropping some service) and we're going to have to start the "catch up to me" process over again.

Opera 12 had the main advantages of:
1. Being different from all the others.
2. Showing the promise of major innovations.
3. Raise enthusiasm from users.
danielson is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:24 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.