Probably the Best Free Security List in the World

I certainly did not mean to insinuate, in my above posting, that the list maker had any ulterior motives; or that he was promoting commercial products by some back-handed means. But I do agree, most strongly, with the point that if the commercial line is crossed, it opens wide a door not nearly wide enough to accommodate all that is out there. The very essence and value of this web site is that it lists such powerful applications which are nevertheless freeware. Allowing commercial products to be listed -- especially without clearly (almost obnoxiously) labeling them as such -- just wastes everyone's (here) time...

...and, perhaps worse, risks making new visitors (who haven't yet learned that Gizmo and his site, here, can be trusted implicitly) think that maybe the promise of this site was really too good to be true after all.

This is important stuff. A web site like this needs to decide what swamp it's going to drain and then drain it. Listing commercial products here (even when properly labeled, in my opinion... but then again, maybe I'm just a purist) is the very definition of "off topic."

That said, I, myself, have mentioned a commercial product or two, a time or two, in my postings around here... but at least I properly labeled them, and explained, alongside my mentioning them, why I dared to so do here. So I'm not suggesting that there's just never a reason to mention a commercial product... especially for purposes of making readers aware of the commercial alternatives to the freeware listed here so that they can see the differences. But commercial products presented in a list like the one on this page sort of runs counter to the whole point of this place.

It's still a great list, though. I hope that that inescapable point didn't get lost in any of my criticism.

This is my biggest irritation regarding freeware -- and especially open-source -- web sites:

The attitude by some that to complain is to look a gift horse in the mouth; and the concomitance of suggestion that the complainant is ungrateful.

Without feedback, philanthropy is blind; and blind philanthropy is reckless and irresponsible.

Even the time of the freeware maker is valuable, and so s/he should always endeavor to be the best possible steward of it. Without feedback, then precisely how is s/he to achieve such responsible stewardship?

(A rhetorical question, mind you.)

ako wrote: "Please tell me some examples of not free and not labelled."

It's unreasonable to expect me to remember them, now, the next day, right off the top of my head. One time through your list, last night, when I discovered the ones I discovered (and, admittedly, there weren't many) is all I'm willing to give. They're there, or I wouldn't have mentioned them. I'm not interested in wasting your time, either.

ako wrote: "If there are non-free products worth mentioning I want to include them."

But that's contrary to the very point of this site; and wishing (otherwise) won't change that.

I understand the the list also appears elsewhere... in a security forum or two, for example. In such places, a mix of freeware and commercial products is probably just fine. But not here... or so it is my opinion.

ako wrote: "I'm not going to check this list all the time checking links. Last time it was done 2 weeks ago. Next time will be a rather long time in the future."

Hence, at least in part, the reason I suggested that what's on this list should be integrated into the rest of this (Gizmo's) web site, into the appropriate categories therein; among my reasons being that at such point the respective editors could take over. The list is almost big enough to warrant its own site. There's no shame in it being a bit difficult for you (or any other single person who has a life and other things to do) to keep up with.

ako wrote: "Unless someone wants to help in this."

Be careful what you wish for. Personally, I think this list deserves its own web site. And I'd be only too happy to donate the web server space, the bandwidth (at least until it becomes so much that we'd have to figure out how to pay for it), the domain name (at least to get it started, then, hopefully, at least enough revenue from it to pay ten bucks for a domain name renewal each year will be derivable from it)... and maybe even the initial development of it, using an easy-to-use CMS so that multiple people, if need be, could help keep it up-to-date. Such a site could simply have both freeware/open-source and commercial sections, and then much of my freeware complaint would be rendered moot. If you'd be interested in something like that, email me at gregg[the@symbol]greggdeselms.com and we can figure it all out. So that Gizmo won't feel weird about this idea hatching here, I'll say, right now, that if this new site were built, I'd want to heavily link to (and promote) this site on it. I think this site is a real gem about which too few people know. I'd be honored to promote this site on that one.

ako wrote: "There are various reasons [for] not linking to original pages."

Like? (That not meant to be as cynical and intentionally challenging as it might seem. I'm seriously interested because I don't want to suggest something like only always linking to the maker's site when there's a genuinely good reason out there not to sometimes.)

ako wrote: "Laziness is only one of them."

Laziness, however subjectively justified, or objectively justifiable, is not really very much of a virtue in a place like this... or so it is just my opinion.

ako wrote: "Please tell me some examples of a non-english site when such is available."

Okay, I do happen to remember one of those, to wit: Unlocker

As of this writing, it links to this page:
http://www.download.fi/jarjestelma/sekalaiset_jarjestelmatyokalut/unlock...

There are others.

ako wrote: "Some "dead" products are still useful. Processguard is an example."

Agreed. But, in my opinion, they should at least be clearly labeled.

ako wrote: "Give examples of dead useless products."

Oy. Again: It ain't my list. It ain't my job. I found them (and, again, there aren't many) when I went through the list last evening. It's unreasonable to expect me to remember them now. I reiterate: I'm not interested in wasting your time, either. If they weren't there, I wouldn't have said they were.

If we decide to build a site for this list (which I hope you'll accept my offer to help you do), then I'll obviously go through it, one by one, and everything will be appropriately labeled.